Switchmaster knob

So I’m going to give it a go with the switchmaster knob.

Mine is from a pantera and does not have the alan screw.

Also smaller than I remember...

Questions;
Does someone have one with the screw they would be willing to loan.
Is making it from aluminum okay?

I can anodize and dye them black, or any color for that matter...

I will look at what it will take to make them out of resin or plastic injection...

Opinions??

This is what black anodizing looks like on the string lock. I have a few ideas on the white dot, especially if it’s aluminum...

What an ambitious fellow you are. Good on ya!

IIRC there were a few iterations of the Switchmaster, but the originals were aluminum (or at least light metal of some sort) so making them out of aluminum would not be out of line historically.

Plastic push-fit knobs were cheaper to make so they became the norm, however there is the possibility of slipping on a push-pull pot if not installed very snug on the shaft. From that perspective the set screw would perhaps offer a more secure lock.

That said, a set screw ideally needs a solid shaft for optimum hold and to prevent a lopsided fit. Otherwise the more common split shaft would need a filler in the space.

A plastic (resin) version would also likely need some sort of knurling or ribbed pattern on the  the internal diameter to assist in gripping the shaft.

I guess you go with whatever manufacturing process best suits you

Are the dimensions the same for both knobs?

Mine don't have the allen screw.

knicelyr wrote:Are the dimensions the same for both knobs?

The membership will no doubt correct me if I'm wrong, but I would expect them to be very close if not identical. The important measurement would be the internal diameter (over the pot shaft) which should be standard and constant. Anything on the outside (of any knob) is really cosmetic.

A set screw version allows for more tolerance, which might be helpful in the case of a hardware change from the original pots. The push fit of course, less so.

Yeah, mate - my metal ones are the same as the plastic ones, near as dammit.
I've got a spare knob with a set screw you can use, Rick.... I'll fire it your way when I get into town.

*edit* my metal ones are non-ferrous, so either pot metal or aluminium....

That’s awesome
Thank you

I see a circular pattern on some that are not on the one from my pantera.

Fun stuff!

Cast in resin you say? On my list of things to do.

That is super cool!
Very similar to how I made my molds, I am going to see what kind of resin he is using for the plastic ones...

Wesley!! I've been watching his stuff for years!! Clever man...

godjira wrote:...Cast in resin you say? On my list of things to do.

Excellent! Very nicely done.

I ordered some of that resin...
Is the white dot recessed and then painted?
Or is is somehow molded in?

That resin doesn't seem to be available in the UK. I will do some more research to see what a local equivalent would be. afaik the dot is paint

The dot is an indentation.

Easy to paint a dot but for ease i use this on any knob needing a dot. Paint pen.

godjira wrote:That resin doesn't seem to be available in the UK. I will do some more research to see what a local equivalent would be. afaik the dot is paint

There's loads of casting resin on ebay UK.

Here's the metal knob with set screw.





See no reason why a set screw could not be tapped in a resin knob. No need for any splines.
If set with the screw in line with the split in the pot shaft they tighten up fine. No problems.

Looks like the same but in metal.

Would the measurement in the pic above be correct for the set screw?

knicelyr wrote:

Would the measurement in the pic above be correct for the set screw?

 
Yep 7mm to the centre

First attempt at resin.
Not too bad but I need some air vents in the mold, or make the bottom solid and drill it out...

Barry,
Did you say there might be a spline cutting tool?

The spline is molded in but may be a little loose...

May be better to drill and spline it...

The other issue I have is that my knob has some marks on it that transferred into the mold.

I have one in route from Corsair so I may use that one for both aluminum and resin replicas.

However I would really like to use a plastic one for the one to be made in resin.

So... shout out to anyone that has one that has a clean top, that would be willing to let me use it for the master mold.

knicelyr wrote:...
Barry,
Did you say there might be a spline cutting tool?

If you're referring to the comment about "ribs" on the internal diameter of the knob, I'm not aware of anything in particular. Not sure what could be used to cut those in, it's a bit of a PITA. Perhaps something heated and pushed into the interior wall diameter rather than cut in?

The plastic knobs have an insert glued in the bottom which has the spline.

It's obvious when looking at the bottom of the knob.

Why not cast the spline from an old pot, drill the new ones and glue them in.

If  I can find an insert I'll send a photo.

That’s a good idea!
I did a cast of the back of the knob and that seems to be working, but I will not know for sure until I have one cast in aluminum.

Hope this weekend.

Westbone wrote:The plastic knobs have an insert glued in the bottom which has the spline...
Why not cast the spline from an old pot, drill the new ones and glue them in.

I forgot about that insert.

Okay,
I think I have the resin ones down.
I’m molding in the spline.
My knob has some wear marks that are coming out on the copy...
John is sending me the metal one so I hope that I can make a better mold. Excited to see what one is these looks like in black anodized aluminum!

knicelyr wrote:I have one in route from Corsair so I may use that one for both aluminum and resin replicas.

No, you don't! You have a plastic one with a set screw en route from me - my metal ones are push on jobs; they have a plastic central boss that is splined....

A tool for making splines is a broaching tool, I think...

Oh okay,
But it still has the set screw and hopefully a better surface than mine did.

Fantastic work guys! 
I didn't see this thread for some reason, great to see some irreplaceable parts being remade again!

Having a go at aluminum.

Fantastic! 
They look good enough to eat!

They look like lil Rolo or Reece’s peanut butter cups!
Lol

Okay,
Not a complete success...
Bees wax, very Smokey and sooty
Vacuum did not pull quick enough and also ran out of aluminum in the well when it did...

I lost over 1/2 of them

Only one didn’t not fill the spline area with aluminum... which is okay and might be the way to go anyhow...

2 or three of these might also get tossed

Would you be inclined to sell some of your cast-aluminum ones? I have an X199 that is missing its original knobs. You wouldn't have to do any finish work at all - I'd take 'em as-is off the vine. I can finish them on my lathe.


Neil

Thanks again for doing this, very satisfying to watch!

Neil,
Yes I can send some to you,
These ones have defects...
John is sending me an original one to work from.

How many do you need?

knicelyr wrote:Neil,
Yes I can send some to you,
These ones have defects...
John is sending me an original one to work from.

How many do you need?

Three. My X199 is my only Westone that had those knobs.


What's your price for them?

Neil

I haven’t really thought about a price, and you will be doing the rest of the work with your tools.

Are you going to paint them?
If so these might work for you just have to fill the imperfections...
Or you can wait till I have Johns knob and copy it...

My goal is to make enough to have punch dies made for the string locks.

Punch dies would be mega!

I've sent the knob on without the OEM square BMD lockplate as I can't find the bloody thing!!

Rick, you gotta charge something, mate - even to cover your expenses; no-one's expecting this sort of thing for nothing, eh!!


(Well.... I am, but I'm a notoriously cheap bastard!)

Johns right, he is a cheap bastard

knicelyr wrote:I haven’t really thought about a price, and you will be doing the rest of the work with your tools.

Are you going to paint them?
If so these might work for you just have to fill the imperfections...
Or you can wait till I have Johns knob and copy it...

My goal is to make enough to have punch dies made for the string locks.

Well think of a price. Free is awesome, but John is right about covering your expenses. I can't confirm that he's a cheap bastard, but I'm willing to take his word on that.

Ideally I'd anodize them, but I may blacken them chemically (Birchwood Casey Aluminum Black). Last option is to paint them.  I don't have an anodizing setup yet, so painting is most likely in the short-term.


Neil

Well eventually I would like to charge, but while I work this stuff out I feel like the "beta" tester or those helping out should have some benefit too, maybe at cost or something...

My goal with this is to put any money right back into something that will let us make other parts.  Cad drawings, 3D printer, Press Punch etc...

"Beta" versions are those that I don't think are quite there, like the knobs, there are some imperfections, partially from the original part and from the process.   The issues related to the process I can fix for the most part.  The original part I may or may not be able to do anything about.

Neil,
I have the ability to anodize these in any color, and I have black on hand.  However that will not deal with the "scratch" that you can see in the face of some of them. Painting would because you could fill those spots.  I am happy to anodize the three best ones for you, dye them black and send them your way. I would ask that you continue this thread with the work you do to finish them up... Deal?

I'm a cheap bastard too btw... LOL

I've had a lot of help from the forum too I'm happy to give back

Back to anodizing...
Very VERY easy...

I picked up a DC power supply that allows me to adjust the amperage and voltage. (some use a battery charger).  You put the part in a bath of weak sulfuric acid and put a positive charge on the part. Part=Positive.  And then the negative goes to the "Plate" in my case I just used an aluminum pan so that the whole pan holding the acid is the "Plate". After the time being anodized, there is a formula..., you just soak it in the heated dye until you get the color you want.  Then you boil it for about an hour to seal it back up.  Btw... you don't have to put any color to it, you can just keep it raw anodized... Still have to do the boil though.

I can start a new thread on that when I do the next batch if there is any interest, maybe these knobs?

That is very cool, and yes; there is interest, Rick!!

Bring it on!!

knicelyr wrote:Well eventually I would like to charge, but while I work this stuff out I feel like the "beta" tester or those helping out should have some benefit too, maybe at cost or something...

My goal with this is to put any money right back into something that will let us make other parts.  Cad drawings, 3D printer, Press Punch etc...

"Beta" versions are those that I don't think are quite there, like the knobs, there are some imperfections, partially from the original part and from the process.   The issues related to the process I can fix for the most part.  The original part I may or may not be able to do anything about.

Neil,
I have the ability to anodize these in any color, and I have black on hand.  However that will not deal with the "scratch" that you can see in the face of some of them. Painting would because you could fill those spots.  I am happy to anodize the three best ones for you, dye them black and send them your way. I would ask that you continue this thread with the work you do to finish them up... Deal?

I'm a cheap bastard too btw... LOL

I've had a lot of help from the forum too I'm happy to give back

Just leave them raw. I look forward to finishing them.  I'll certainly post my finishing work.

Neil

Neil,
Send me a PM with your address and I’ll get them off to you.

knicelyr wrote:
Or you can wait till I have Johns knob and copy it...

LOL anybody want one (sorry childish I know but couldnt help myself)  

Lol...  So I DID phrase that correctly ??  lol

Yes, yes.... nothing to see here.... move along....

I got the knobs that knicelyr sent last week, but couldn't do anything with them because my gallbladder hose that day to go wonky.
They look great for rough casting. I can't wait to get back in the shop and have a go at them. I think they'll look great.