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Post by corsair on Sat Oct 19, 2019 7:36 pm

OK, OK... I know this has been a long time coming, but I'm starting to move forward; a little!

It occurs to me that I have Bendmaster FT and Bendmaster Deluxe bridges in the spares box, and these things came out with Bendmaster gear as the Spectrum II so that is a way forward without breaking the bank by replacing the Kahler or by having the hole filled in professionally and hard tailing it, which was my preferred option. I found, however, that my woodworking skills weren't up to the task, considering I'm trying to keep the OEM finish...

So. I offered up both bridges, and it helped that the post spacing for the Kahler was the same as the post spacing for the Bendmaster, though the inserts required some ...persuasion! I was getting quite excited at this stage until I ran a straight edge and a level across the saddles and up the neck, whereupon I found that the stringpack is going to need moving across about 2.5mm, thus the post holes need to be filled and new holes drilled; hardly insurmountable and will be the way forward.

The question I'm asking the readership here is which one do you like better in the oversized hole that a bloody Kahler requires; the FT, or the Deluxe??

Bendmaster FT...

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Bendmaster Deluxe...

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Post by Barry on Sat Oct 19, 2019 8:28 pm

Holy cr@p, that's a big 'ole mate! Snackin

Well, the Deluxe certainly looks more at home in that wading pool and it would seem to be more aesthetically in tune with the overall design of the Corsair.

What's the plan for the crater then, paint it out?

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Post by knicelyr on Sat Oct 19, 2019 9:34 pm

Pretty guitar!
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Post by knicelyr on Sat Oct 19, 2019 11:27 pm

I have an idea for the hole.

I put cut some rubber to put under my trem when I changed out my bendmaster.

You could cut a piece and epoxy it below the trem and it would look like it was supposed to be there!Corsair - John's Corsair... B09d7c10
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Post by corsair on Sun Oct 20, 2019 4:21 am

You know, there was originally a thin strip of foam rubber on that ledge and I am indeed planning to put something there. I've already painted it flat black and it looks heaps better, especially with a black Deluxe!
The width of the stringpack at the nut is 37mm and the width of the Deluxe is 53mm, and I am assumng - at the minute - that the scale length is Fender so I have a little bit of fettling to do, repositioning the bridge.
Bit of research to do....

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Post by corsair on Sun Oct 20, 2019 7:57 am

A request for the hive mind....

.... does anyone here have a Corsair? I need to know the scale length....

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Post by Westbone on Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:19 am

Didn't you get a neck with that?
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Post by corsair on Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:52 am

Yep, I did but I don't know where the saddles are on a Kahler 2710 in relation to the post holes. I figure if I know the scale length, then I can take the measurement from the front edge of the locking nut to wherever it goes, mark it and work out the optimal position for the Bendmaster.
You have any suggestions? I'm happy to be corrected/advised, mate!!

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Post by Westbone on Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:30 am

Measure from the nut to the 12th fret and double it.
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Post by corsair on Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:41 am

.... of course you do!! Thank you... I can be remarkably dense sometimes!

While you're there... the Kahler looks to sit flush with the body and the Bendmasters are designed to sit above the body; can you see any major issues with that, aside from having the posts wound out a bit more that is usual for these things?? It could make the bridge a little unstable although I suppose string tension will keep it taut enough?

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Post by Westbone on Mon Oct 21, 2019 9:03 am

Don't foresee any problems
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Post by corsair on Sat Nov 02, 2019 3:44 am

OK troops; I have a smallish problem that is causing me grief..

I have a Bendmaster Deluxe to put in the hole and I need to find an optimum position for the bridge anchors... normally no great issue as you find the scale length, which I've done, put the saddles in the middle of their range and whacko - Robert's your muvvers' bruvver!! You should have enough movement fore and aft for any intonation issues.

Bendmaster Deluxes have a series of threaded holes which are angled across the plate....

Corsair - John's Corsair... Img_1210

... which make finding a middle position a little tricky. The distance from the edge of the bridge to the back of the furthest hole is 11mm on one and 8mm on the other; do I halve the error and make a 'middle' line 9.5mm across the plate to establish a saddle line??
And where should I set the saddle line: surely not at 25.5"; this would not allow much backwards movement of the saddle should it require it?! Perhaps saddles at 25.25"?

Am I over-thinking this? Any suggestions most abjectly gratefully accepted!! :-D

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Post by Westbone on Sun Nov 03, 2019 4:28 am

Those holes in the plate are to give the saddles more scope for intonation.

Angled from fat E to skinny E as a normal guitar bridge would appear when set up.

If you have another guitar with a BMD use it as a template.
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Post by corsair on Sun Nov 03, 2019 6:09 am

Yes, I know they are.

I realise that, but a normal bridge has long screws and springs on the saddles so lining the saddles up in the middle of the intonation screw travel is easy. You're saying take a line from the front hole on the low E to the back hole on the high E and I should be within cooee for the purposes of the exercise??

I do indeed have other BMD equipped guitars, but their saddles are all over the place and their intonation is bang on - what about my last; where should I set the saddle line on the scale length? 25¼" 25½"

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Post by Westbone on Sun Nov 03, 2019 2:44 pm

Well it's a 25.5" scale so it is... Thumb Up....in the middle of the adjustment range.
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Post by corsair on Sun Nov 03, 2019 9:58 pm

OK; we're moving forward, albeit slowly...

looking pretty good over the frets - there's 3.5mm on both terminal frets from the string to the edge of the fingerboard...

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However, when I marked the anchor posts, I realised that the fillet of wood behind the high E string anchor will be miniscule and will breakout under strain.

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So... do I move the bridge forward a ¼", or do I reinforce the wood with a piece of aluminium epoxied and screwed into place? I've done this before on that red Avenger so it may be the way forward as I really don't want to deny the guitar any intonation travel...

That piece of wood in the recess under the front of the bridge may well be staying there as this bridge is designed to sit above the body surface, and from what I've seen of the Kahler, its' design is semi-recessed. What that means in real terms is that if the BMD goes into the same space as the Kahler, the posts will have to be wound out to get the action correct far more than they are on any other BMD guitar I have here, which can't be good for tuning stability or anything else!

Thoughts, gentlemen, please...

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Post by Westbone on Mon Nov 04, 2019 3:10 am

Well the threaded insert will sit through your bit of wood and into the body.

By the time the inserts are in that fillet will have gone.

The force is forward up the neck not backwards.
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Post by corsair on Mon Nov 04, 2019 4:37 am

Yes, but while the top of the post is pulled towards the neck, the laws of physics tell us that the bottom of the anchor will push out in the other direction; this one already has a small piece of wood pushed out at the bottom of the post anchor, and my Vantage strat had the same issue. 
Do you agree with my supposition about the relative height of the saddles on the Kahler .v. BMD?

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Post by Westbone on Mon Nov 04, 2019 5:27 am

 this one already has a small piece of wood pushed out at the bottom of the post anchor, and my Vantage strat had the same issue. wrote:Do you agree with my supposition about the relative height of the saddles on the Kahler .v. BMD?


No wonder Mile sold it, just fix it best you can.
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Post by knicelyr on Mon Nov 04, 2019 8:25 am

Could you use a metal plate and epoxy and screw it to the stronger wood below? maybe then epoxy a piece of wood veneer over the plate so it looks like wood under the bridge?

Kind of spread the load across a larger area and tap the plate for the anchor?

Keep in mind, I am really new to guitar restoration... LOL
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Post by The Chad on Mon Nov 04, 2019 2:25 pm

I would replace with a Kahler as it was designed for.  Anything else will not look right.  I know it's an investment, but can you see a Bendmaster actually looking right in that cavity?  You'd be stuck with it, too... as trying to sellthe Corsair with a retro fitted bridge with glued wood may be very tough.
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Post by Westbone on Mon Nov 04, 2019 2:50 pm

Glue it and screw it....
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Post by corsair on Mon Nov 04, 2019 3:25 pm

Damian - dead set!! That's what's gonna happen, mate!

Chad - this is me, Corsair the cheap bastid, so there will be no Kahler! And I don't sell guitars... ask my wife!! This was a cheap guitar, and I'm very comfortable customising/fixing/buggerising about with it in order to hear it sing again so any loss of perceived value is of no concern to me

Any repair will be invisible once the bridge is in place, and a lick of black paint will make it disappear even more - that rout is like the Black Hole of Calcutta! 

Thanks all for comments and observations - this is a new wrinkle for me, and I'm enjoying the challenge!!

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Post by corsair on Wed Nov 06, 2019 1:42 am

So... here we are, then...

Corsair - John's Corsair... Dsc_8110

... epoxied in and screwed. Belt and braces, I know but I don't really want to re-visit this in years to come... and seeing as how I'd done one side...

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... I thought I may as well to the other! Probably didn't need to as there's plenty of wood there for the purpose, but, what the hell - I'm having fun!!

I've since epoxied the top piece of wood into place so once everything's set and cured, I'll paint all of the new bits flat black then holes will be drilled and anchors inserted!

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Post by Westbone on Wed Nov 06, 2019 2:46 am

Belt and braces mate..... Thumb Up
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Post by Barry on Wed Nov 06, 2019 9:37 am

Braces and belt, yup, that oughta do it!
Next thing you know you'll be wearing matching socks and sandals! geek

corsair wrote:And I don't sell guitars... ask my wife!!
Oh mate, ain't it the truth?! It's a sickness I tells ya.

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